So the goal is to generate that little laugh, that little piece of remembrance that has a spark about it. Be a good people cool thingscom. I we use that on our other podcast, parks and wrecked, for buzzing in on Trivia. Its storytelling at its finest. What next? I think the game needs to be simple. What else goes into that recipe? So that's just a another nice element to it, I think. So they got to set her rooms. And you're not really selling it. He incorporates standup comedy into his shows. So, in essence, since we're all, I would say all of our social skills have gotten rusty, are over the past year and a half during the panic. Its that instant when flavors come together and explode in your mouth. I love that he's my friend and not doesn't quite fit your most famous, but most interesting for sure. And you mentioned joke tellers. 
Actually, I'm here's a question from I believe this was in the news and they and the question is who was older, Elizabeth the second when she became queen or Freddie Mercury when he became queen? That's how I wound up doing business with all of these companies. She performed one of Richie's songs during Season 19 of American Idol and she's kept the good times going since then. There is something very nice to feel the fresh tug and pull of something that's old and familiar, like playing games, but it's but it's new again. It is both art and science. So we're chatting all about that good stuff and it's just a blast brand of so many good stories, and I hope that by the end of this episode you're like, I need to create a board game of my own and share it with the world, because I certainly felt inspired after talking with Brian. So I feel like you asked. I believe they're made in house too! It's why we moved to team play, because teams helped people who were shy, people who were who lacked the same bravado or confidence. He writes columns and Connoisseur magazine and is a photographer with works hanging in galleries and museums from Japan to Mexico, in many, many places. Search across all episodes within this podcast. I like that. My very first I got into this business because I was a good trivial pursued player and friends of mindset, your creative you could probably make a game and I thought, well, that's interesting, but I was a real estate developer, I was in business, so I did what a business guy does. So I'm finding out all this stuff about Marcel Mar so and it turns out he's a legion of Honor winner. I love here in from of you, love chatting with you and if you really want to support the show, head on over to the merch store at good people, cool thingscom shop and we will get you all the goodies that you need so you're cozy and looking fantastic while you're playing one of Brian's board games. And and on the radio there there the news is talking about Ronald Reagan at it some remembrance of D Day from World War Two, and I thought, gi, I remember a lot about d day. I was there. If you make something too silly, that the competitive ones aren't happy, if you make something too competitive, than casual gamers aren't necessarily satisfied. You keep the inventory. Sure you know they brought out a group, brought out winning not no, they I'm trying to remember the name of it now. Yeah, I'll allow it. Love it. I was never offended when a company said this doesn't fit our wish list right now. He says rose. Brians latest game, Boom Again, targets a totally underserved market: Boomers, or people born between 1946 and 1964. Third Base? I'm a bust. Let me give you a little bit of background, because it'll explain how boom again happened. There's and art to so much of what's required. Now I'm down with the the lame joke as well as you. That perceived value is critically important, but you can't break the bank getting it. Plus knowing that you don't want to be too hard. I don't know. So it's it's going to be fantastic. On this episode, Brian Talks about the key to making a successful board game, whether it's art or science, might be a little bit of a combination of both, and why he calls them social lubricators his games, which come in very handy after I don't know about you, but my post pandemic social interactions have not been the smoothest, so I appreciate any kind of social lubricant that I can get to help me through it. You get to the mid S and we discover sex and run and drugs and rock and roll and we're no longer playing board games. They're not obligated to taste. There's a lot of singing group saying excellent that, but but there's also those the little sparks, the little things that disappeared somewhere back in your brain and that you forgot were there, and you sort of noodle around a going you know, I got a hunch it might be a volkswagon beetle, and I like it that it takes you back to a time before of before the Internet, being like Oh, I can just easily look that up real quick, like making you think about that and where you you wouldn't have the answer right away back correct when you were doing that.
So I take the colony says, listen, I just want you to now. Marie is a self-taught cook who's been featured in Bon Apetit, Food & Wine, and The Rachael Ray Show, among others. We found out what wasn't working. And suddenly I'm going off in a direction saying I think there's a I think there's an entertainment product, I think there's an opportunity. So it's we SARENDIPITY's a wonderful thing and occasionally we step into it and it and instead of going ankle deep and going why did I step in here, we float alonggoing well, we got this one right, and the boom zooms have been one of them. I've had games that I knew were great from the minute that they were done.
We're talking about all of that and more in this episode. On the famous Abbey road album cover, beetles are crossing the street. So you got to really be selected and periodically put in that answer. I will I will count it. The actual ice creammore. Some of them have bought their first houses, others are paying rents that are too high. It's great and and that's so so factor that in as well. He's got he's got photography across the world. You've kind of been touching on this throughout in terms of having the the social lubricant and not making trivia like to too difficult if it is a trivia based game. They were going to produce it for us and I had to negotiate the contract. It was called Car Duccy and it was just this very simple game where you were you everyone was dealt cards and the each card had one letter on it and you have to come up with a word for eat for as many as you could in a row. I've got one right, I'll get in so much trouble here. This doesn't meet you know, I a a an important role for us.
I'M gonna I'm gonna let you leave. And and that was you know, it wasn't just me who didn't get it. It's hysterical to watch, you know. Welcome to good people, cool things. ha ha ha. Did you have visions for all of these other Games too, or did that come after they were like, okay, we need more? Well, two are really famous and one should be more things. I'd love for people to do even more and interesting things with gaming. Well, I my my problem is that I am by nature a smartass and I have never hesitated to let that side of me show through in Games. We've written somewhere around six thousand outburst topics, because the game is, you know, it's just been around so long and we keep trying to keep it for us. | By Sugarox. It's the same product over and over. I've already got some people in mind that I'm going to need to play this with. Go ahead, try our little Pineapple flavor candy pillow and give yourself that moment of flavor fabulous your tastebuds deserve. In one thousand nine hundred and eighty five is reported to have sold over twenty million games in one year. I think there's a business there. So we basically said, well, wait to say let's let's let's redesign the game let's just alter the play pattern a little and give everybody rules and and directions on how to play it on zoom and it took off. So when you'll Zipper, I get one point for each one of those cards I used. Needs another rewrite. I played with my whole family. You've got the BUZZER. So yes, I have harder questions and thoughtful questions, and our goal is to make people saying. There's an art to the marketing methodologies, and yet those are also science. How does this get sold at retail? Never offended that you don't. We should get in it. Yeah, I agree. Only I could read a contract and I looked to said no, no, no, and in the end I want to say no to every company at least once. And then at a layer on too that, because you ask how you make the game now, how does the game physically present? We built a game aimed baby booms and what we're hearing from the from from our players all over the country is I played with my kids. The jets of the Jetson's dog was astro pastor our, yes, and they walked them on the treadmill outside the spaceships. Pineapple Galore Tamalitoz Pineapple flavor candy pillow filled with chili, lime and sea salt, Colored with Annatto, Spirulina Extract and Turmeric Oleoresin, Individual Pineapple Galore Tamalitoz, Five Pack Pineapple Galore Tamalitoz, 2021 Tamalitoz | All Rights Reserved. That's exactly what Marie Saba has done with her book Don't Worry Be Ha-PEA: 101 Deliciously Clever Food Puns. I didn't think that was a business model that worked and I saw there were plenty of people way more experienced who should be doing it, and so I let them. He was open to it, he was fascinated by it and while we were while I was at his home, walking around, you know, many acres out in the country. If you like to get in touch with good people cool things, you can do so via facebook, twitter or in Instagram at GPCT podcast. This is what works and this is what doesn't. And Parker brothers, Milton Bradley stand on the dock and with a tear in their eye, they wave goodbye. I've had grains that I thought were okay that made it modestly. It's a boomer culture trivia game. I'm a huge fan of wordplay one of my favorite articles I've ever written is about the O. Henry Pun-Off in Austin. It's an essay tale, like you're saying. I gave it first to Parker brothers, showed it to them, left it with them and that you know they're going to think about a review and call me the like in a week. It's like that canvas that you know when you played Tri of you pursue. Are you just following a recipe? Other Games we've done is joint ventures. Two major players, one season one way, one season another. Where did the idea of this come from, because this is going to lead us into a bunch of different places. Published or do you license it? Will Wood isn't like most musical artists. That just irritates people. If you've got one, I'd love to hear it as well. What's the other example? But what else goes into the success? But once you have the game idea and you can you can take a game that you've created, if you want to walk us through this. This success is about and entire generation returning to its game playing roots. There are two kinds of players of games, those who are competitive, they want to win, and those that just want to have a good time. But how many companies can exist selling fifty two pieces of paper in a box? And I had a list and I walked in the House and to deflect my wife from killing me upon my entry, I turned to everybody and said tell me ten things about the battle of the bulge, and they all started yelling out snow, Panzers, Germans, you know, yeah, patent, and they said what are we doing, Brian? I'm thinking of the last time I played in it was there's one person in particular that probably was on an actual roller coaster because they were doing and they were God nuts. Here's a game that is has a very wide but not very deep knowledge base, sort of like a liberal arts education, and it strikes this enormous generation at just the right moment when they want to stay home. Some of them are a little off color. And for now let's hop into the conversation. And he hates social media even as it's brought him tons of new fans and millions of new listens.
Brian Hirsch is the creator of more than Forty Board Games that have sold over fifty million copies. But let's let's hop back to your initial for a into the gaming industry, because do I have this right that you started as a real estate developer, and we're a pretty successful one, before switching into games. He's created outburst, supers, categories, taboo, among so many others, and he's at it again with his latest board game, boom again, a pop culture game aimed at boomers that I'm not a boomer, but I had a blast just with a couple of the questions while we're chatting through it. Thank you so much for coming on and chatting all about board games and creating, and I hope you've inspired at least one person to create something fantastic that makes you slap your head and wish you did it too. Good people cool things as a podcast feature and conversations with entrepreneurs, writers, musicians and other creatives. If I gave you, if I said to you ten cars rich people drive and you named all ten that were on the card, that's ten out of ten. One of my learnings was trivia is for a lot of people that's an sat test and if you and if you want to do that, you know there's trivial pursuit, there's hard trivial games. Your first thought is, all, I could have made this. Put It in the game. What do we need in perceived value? So we invested in having people come in and sit and test play and we discovered a lot. It'd be like I just did this exercise, I didn't even enjoy it. Traffic was slow and I'm late for a dinner party at my house. It's like that painting at the museum that's a great big red canvas with a black circle and it's sold for seven million dollars. They have a great selection of unique candies.more, Received the chocolate and caramel dipped pretzels, bear claw and chocolate dipped sour keys as a gift.
I agree with you.
I had a there was a particular woman and this many years later, I do not recall her name she was. See, I laid those down and said metal teeth serving as pants closer. Your friends and family love you, they're impressed. In the testing is where we found all of the that secret sauce. I'll give you mine. We found out, you know, Gede, they read the rules we wrote but after, you know, the first two paragraphs, they got lost. And I looked at my cards in my hand and I put down the letters M T S A pe. All Right, now, I'm inspired. Now that I mean it's as the legitimate question. You're getting the chance to interact like you were young. I mean it's surprising. If you got to be willing to swing and this and that happens and and frankly I still think a couple of my very best games ever never got license, never got built, never appeared anywhere. And the guy is sitting there. And we did that by having everyone play on teams. They're sitting in the back room amongst all those games that just didn't work. There's a several factors that come into that. When I when we started, the big companies were JC penny and sears and and Kmart and toys R us. It is a it is self published. I've always looked never been able to sell that game. So my question for your team is, okay, name the person on third base. Well, awesome, well, Brian, I say this with no surprise because I've had so many hours of entertainment playing your games, but this was a blast.
In the case of taboo, we had built the game, we knew exactly what it was going to cost, we had the title, you know, we already grabbed the copyright in the trademark. How are you doing? So if I got a topic card and I read it and it said Zipper, that was the word I needed to communicate to other players. What's on second? Never never been was sell it. If you're a fan of this episode, go ahead and hit that follow button. So our goal is always how do we balance those two elements? We did not license it, we did it ourselves. So Marcel would be number two. So that's certainly a piece of how I approach Writing Games. It tested over the moon and the reactions told us so that's the way we went. If you do make it too hard, then it's not a fun game to play. And if you're going to do if you're going to deal with Trivia, if you're going to ask people to remember things, then why not give them the added benefit of additional memory power? I don't know. It's quality, it's pricy, it's not just posable and that was something baby boomers expected. But this time I really relied on the pup pop culture leanings and background of baby boomers and that became the impetus to build this game and to build it the way we built it. It's a volkswagon beetle. Once the you know, once I had a perception of what I thought the game should feel like and I learned what a game should engineer, in other words, what's it going to cost? But you got to do the work and then you've got to not fall in the tramp of saying well, if there's a list of ten, that's good enough. Dick Clark and I met after my first game. The Game Business, the Board Game Business, had no experience selling things to adults. Pineapple Galore Tamalitoz mixes your dream vacation to Hawaii with a Spring Break moment of absolute indulgence and packs it into an un assuming candy pillow. It's a great game. I could have made this, but the truth is you couldn't. Boom Againcom and and you'll end and I'm there too, so they can find me, but better to find the game. So I think mark is one of the most interesting people I will ever know. Well, the next week I have the VP from Milton Bradley at my office and I'm showing them something totally different and I get interrupted by an assistant who says can you come out of here please, which I'm going you're interrupting this, and she says the guy from Parker brothers is on the phone. As you know, every episode we end with a Corny joke. There's an art to building a product that people want. They're tongue in cheek. You've done anything and, God bless them, they lie. He was already older. Put them both together and you've got some MAGIC. It's one player as a taboo and the other one has a Mickey Mass Button that goes Oh boy, I'll have to send you. And by the way, we don't like the price.
Well, it's, I've always said, what I do, because I focus on social interaction Games, party games. Are you answered one of my questions just with that of can people under roughly fifty five years old still enjoy this game? I may not know the answer, but the but my teammate next to me might know part of it. Yeah, sure, I'll tell you that. If you were staring down a legend like Lionel Richie, how do you think you'd respond? I'll defer to my jess. Baby boomers are making money. It's just it's just work. This was beyond his comprehension and he he wanted to put his makeup on before he got in front of the electronic cameras and I had to tell him that it can't see you. You know who Abbott and Costello are. I've read this report and think that this information is so fascinating we need to follow it. It's such a healthy opportunity, absolutely and within boom again do you have a favorite trivia question? But in the end the contract issues were worked out in what was a fair way. People, good people, cool things is produced in Austin, Texas. I said it's my next game, and that turned out to be outburst. What kind of car can be seen part at the curb just behind them, and this is when everybody can figure out. A boom zoom and even more generally, just a good zoom game experience. You cost engineer to satisfy your major clients. I know I'm in trouble. So I made based on what I knew was in different companies current lines and what their needs were for the next year. What makes you feel good about the money you spent to have this play experience, and and and that's critical factor. I tried it out every four or five or six years to somebody. If I said to you name ten pieces of silverware and you named them, you wouldn't care. You know, eighty million people all born, you know, and from nineteen forty five, one thousand nine hundred and sixty four roughly, and they've got all the money in the world. You're going to get royalties like it's a record. So I'd hear her negatives, but by filtering them we learned a lot. I think that I never wanted to take things too seriously. So we said, but there's Zoomi there zooming with their children, their grandchildren, they're seeing each other, they're having a drink night. You saw Djanga. It allowed them to be part of a group and that group paradigm is wonderful in the social setting. In this episode, Kate shares some of her top stories from her American Idol experience, some of the worst experiences in her life, her top tips for building a successful music brand, and why it's important to always give your all in any situation.
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